E18: What It Really Means to Be a "Has Been" with Jonathan Mookie Morant

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant wrote and produced for the Backstreet Boys, NSYNC, Justin Timberlake, and Queen Latifah, and then walked away from all of it to be present for his kids. His memoir The Happy Has Been is about what he found on the other side of that choice.

In this conversation we talk about chasing a dream, redefining success, and why the life you've already lived is worth honoring, not mourning.

What We Talk About In This Episode

• Mookie's journey from childhood musician to working with some of the biggest names in pop music
• The moment he realized his dream was coming true but he still wasn't happy
• Why he chose his children over his career, and what that decision cost and gave him
• The power of connection: why every door that opened in his life came through a relationship
• What "has been" really means, and why he wears it proudly
• The difference between chasing the spotlight and living with purpose
• Why love is the thing that actually moves people

CONNECT WITH MOOKIE

Website: thehappyhasbeen.com

Instagram: @jonathanmookiemorant

Email: themagnumdrummer@gmail.com

Learn more about the Roman’s World Foundation at thehappyhasbeen.com

Get Angie's Book: Girl in the Spotlight — available in print and audio 

Subscribe to Angie's weekly letter Hello Friday

Instagram: @angiemizzell

Transcript

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Angie Mizzell (00:23)
Hey everyone it's Angie Mizzell and welcome to More Like You. You just heard me read a few lines from The Happy Has Been, a memoir by Jonathan Mookie Morant. Mookie lives here in Charleston and he's joining me today to talk about his career as an award-winning musician, songwriter, and record producer. He's worked with artists like the Backstreet Boys, Genuine, N'Sync, 98 Degrees, Justin Timberlake, and Queen Latifah, just to name a few.

In his book, he takes us on a full circle ride from childhood dreams coming true to becoming a single father, from ramen noodles to riches, and ultimately back to what really matters. He shares how he discovered the true happiness that was there all along. We're digging into what being a has-been really means and how it just might be something to celebrate.

Angie Mizzell (01:15)
Mookie, I want to start by talking about how we met just right before we started this podcast. We were talking about our books and I just want to tell everyone we were both nominated last year, City Paper Best Local Author. So I remember my son saying that he knew your daughter.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (01:20)
⁓ wonderful.

Wow.

Angie Mizzell (01:37)
And I was like, what? was like, I need to know

this person is. But also I had friends saying, yeah, Mookie, he used to play with the Backstreet Boys. And I'm like, well, I have lost the competition. I don't think I'm going win this one. But, you know, it's interesting that I actually did not know your story and quickly realized that you were somebody that I wanted to meet to

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (01:54)
Whatever.

Hmm

Angie Mizzell (02:05)
have someone locally who's written a memoir

can you start by telling everyone about your book, The Happy Has Been? What inspired it? What inspired you to write this book?

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (02:12)
I'm

Wow, that's amazing. Well, thank you, Angie, for having me here with you. And I love when you talking about how we met because that's kind of it reminds me of the start of writing this book. It's all about human connection, which is, you know, the word connections in my subtitle, six degrees of connection, which you know, we've heard the term six degrees of separation, but.

I always say that kind of connotes a divide. You know what I mean? And I think connection is everything. But back to your question, the beginning of this book was, it really boiled down to what most things boil down to in my life was my kids. I had ran into someone who was involved in the book industry,

and said, really, I've looked at everything you put on social media because that's where I did all my writing. Because before this book, I hadn't really been a writer other than a songwriter, but that's another thing. ⁓ so we connected through her reading my stuff on social media. And then, but I didn't see myself writing any book. I thought that was just a towering.

you know, something too lofty for me. Imposter syndrome.

Angie Mizzell (03:33)
A book is big. A book is big.

I do.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (03:37)
you get it. And that's what I told

people. They're like, well, you're a songwriter. I'm like, man, that is literally a few words on one side of a piece of paper, not to diminish it, because the whole book is kind of surrounding my history in songwriting. But essentially, my children, I spoke to each of them at the time when this first began. That was a gosh.

Angie Mizzell (03:44)
Mm-hmm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (04:00)
2019, mean, believe it or not, when I first thought about it, and I was like, well, this is gonna be a massive endeavor in my mind. I thought it was, and it's gonna take time, certain kind of commitment and dedication. So I would have to juggle some of that with, you know, I'm still playing all my gigs and spending time with them. And they were, you know, they were younger, a little bit younger then. was still, so it was a time issue.

Angie Mizzell (04:25)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (04:30)
and all of them are like, yeah, dad, that'll be cool. And then I thought of the fact that some of them, I have five children, but two of them, they weren't even alive at any point when I was in the record business. And I was like, man, they don't know my story, except on occasion, they'll see something, Backstreet Boys or Justin Timberlake or whatever it is. And they'll be like, daddy, you know them. But it's so, know, dis-

Angie Mizzell (04:39)
you

Mm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (04:53)
connected and I wanted them to understand their dad so that maybe one day they can connect their own dots.

Angie Mizzell (04:54)
Mm-hmm.

I want to do something that's just coming to me now. So I'm gonna grab my readers and I'm gonna pull up something in the introduction. Well, well let's see if I can even find it.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (05:04)
Yes, please, please, please. I like that.

man, I hope I read the book. It's so good.

Angie Mizzell (05:17)
Yeah.

It's the first few lines of the introduction.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (05:32)
Mmm.

Mmm.

Yeah.

Angie Mizzell (05:48)
If you know, sometimes a story that you have to tell doesn't come to you in the order that you lay it out. But I wondered how much of it really did stem from having such a big high profile career and then coming almost full circle where people are like, why are you doing this? What? Why did you walk away from this?

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (05:54)
Yeah.

Angie Mizzell (06:14)
But the title is the happy has been so we'll get into that. But I wondered how much of it was a reflection of having really risen to this level of fame and then having your life go full circle.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (06:18)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Well, first, it's weird having you read that. I just got chills because maybe that's why I wear these shades all the time. I think there's a lot of catharsis going on right now because...

You know, it is very emotional to think of the wave that is ridden at, or rather a pendulum swing. That might be a better analogy from having a dream to achieve something, you know, a goal that everyone tells you is one in a million. And then somehow, you know, getting there.

know, scaling those mountains with full intention of, you know, achieving and triumph and then to completely return from that. that's again, that's the story in there. But that's a life lived and years and blood, sweat, tears, obviously.

not to even mention the personal things that are going on in your life at the time. you know, I really put my life, my everything into

living in that world of, it's show business. But for me, and again, this has to do with my upbringing. I come from a musical and a show business driven family. But for me, it is real life. It wasn't just a show.

Angie Mizzell (07:53)
So we'll just kind of take everyone through the story. You do come from this musical family. And so what initially sparked the thing in you to go, I'm going to really go for this. I want to make it in the entertainment industry. How old were you? And when did you really start to take that?

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (07:55)
Yeah, yeah.

Hmm.

Angie Mizzell (08:14)
Seriously.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (08:15)
Yeah, and this is where it's interesting because there was never a time where I wasn't absolutely certain that I was going to be a musician or in one shape or form or the other. I'm talking about from childhood. I grew up on a stage. My first memory is holding drumsticks. I mean, I wasn't two years old. And then my dad,

And mom, they developed me and my brothers, we were one year apart into this group. But this is literally the unknown Jackson story as the Morants So I was always on stage. I was always performing. I was always singing or playing or doing music. But then I suppose maybe at the ripe old age of 12, 13, I would listen to music and something creative started.

churning inside of me. At first it was a band. I had my brothers and we all were musicals. So was like, well, there you go, us four, we're gonna do a band.

but I would always be creative with it. I'd always want to learn new things. I learned how to use the keyboard to write songs. And when I saw Prince, Michael Jackson, Lionel Richie, and I know those guys were writing songs and producing records, that was

Angie Mizzell (09:26)
So there were moments when you were on the rise, when you were about to give up and there was a scene that was very impactful. Your friend Mike and I went back to, I just want to make sure I'm getting this right. So Mike is a friend who drove you to Atlanta.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (09:34)
Yeah.

Mmm.

Yeah.

You're good, you know this better than I do, but yeah, it's bringing it all back, yep.

Angie Mizzell (09:52)
But

something happened. and you were deflated. It was a setback and yeah, definitely defeated. And he just said, I'm sorry, but don't give up. And there was something about the sincerity of his, I don't give up, there was a belief there. And

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (09:57)
Yeah, defeated, believe me. Yeah.

Yeah.

Angie Mizzell (10:14)
It almost seems like not only did that re-encourage you, but I wondered if you felt like a responsibility to the people who believe in you, or there's something about knowing that other people have this hope in you. So just tell me a little bit more about that moment, just knowing that you had other people believing in you and how that helped.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (10:33)
Well, you absolutely nailed my feeling at the

was a hub, was becoming the next kind of New York or LA in terms of the music business at the time. So we were like, well, we're going to go down there.

me and my brother Joe, when I say we, my older brother Joe, he was my tag team partner then, we were gonna try and go there and get a record deal. Little did we know. But anyways,

Angie Mizzell (10:55)
All right.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (10:57)
things went completely south,

that was the moment, I was like, well wait a minute, this is it. And it didn't work.

Angie Mizzell (11:07)
Mm-hmm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (11:07)
That's

it, the end. And that five whatever hour drive back.

My whole life from being a little kid on stage, from my dad and mom, the memories I have with them in California, trying to, know, showcasing us performing as little boys, everything I had ever understood as my passion and my DNA and my mission in music and life became dark. On that entire drive, that five hour drive might as well have been a week.

And when we got in there, I stayed at my friend's house, before he went to sleep, he said, man, I'm sorry, it didn't work out. And this guy my brother, Mike, Mike Stafford, He's not an emotional guy. I'm an emotional guy. He's not. That isn't his style. But that night he felt it.

Angie Mizzell (11:41)
Mm.

Mm-hmm.

Mm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (11:54)
I think he was trying to urge me, don't give up because this was just a moment. And I never, the thought never occurred to me to don't give up because it never occurred to me that I would ever not make it. It's very bold of me. And I, and it was, I guess, some ways hubris, but mostly it wasn't because I was all about the love. I just never understood any other concept.

Angie Mizzell (11:56)
Mm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (12:18)
than what was in front of me and I'm going for it. But his little, don't give up to me, reminded me of who I was. And through that darkness, something switched. It switched, it made me understand, okay, firstly,

Angie Mizzell (12:28)
Mm-hmm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (12:35)
This ain't gonna be some gift handed to you, son. Nah, if you are really here for this, you're gonna have to show. You're gonna have to show it. You have to be it and do it.

And then that was it.

Angie Mizzell (12:47)
I want to just reflect back a couple things you've already said, but it feels worth repeating. The first thing is your friend, he went on that journey with you. He drove you. And so it's not like he was just over on the sidelines like he was right there with you when this disappointment happened. The other thing is that you said I you felt like that was the shot.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (13:06)
Yes.

Angie Mizzell (13:12)
Like I was going out to make it and it didn't work out. And I think about how many times we get that setback and we think we blew our shot and we realize, know, what you already said, but this is just one step in the journey.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (13:15)
Yes.

Angie Mizzell (13:30)
things.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (13:30)
It was the

most important thing. I don't mean to cut you off, you're nailing the point. think, excuse me, I don't think. Folks, trust me when I tell you. It's hard, but grab for those moments. mean, live for them. When you get your door slam moment, your first, for example, your door slam moment.

Angie Mizzell (13:33)
No, no, please.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (13:50)
man, dude, it's hallelujah day. It's jump around and call your friends. Say, did it. I got, I got rejected. Do it. I got it. Because once you do that and you're still, you realize you're still here. You realize you still have the passion and you can turn into that. And thank God you have support. You know, you're a friend or, whatever, or even someone you don't know cheering you on or whatever it is. That's when you can.

Angie Mizzell (13:56)
I got rejected.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (14:20)
pivot or land and continue. You get to continue and now you've been through it. So what? You're here. You're good. You can keep going. You can go and not give up until you get there until you get that moment. You don't know. It's important,

Angie Mizzell (14:36)
That's right.

and I think that

you also make the point that the no's are the path to yes. The path to the yes is paved with the no's. It takes something not working out to put you in front of the thing that is your yes.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (14:47)
That's it.

Yes.

Yes.

Angie Mizzell (14:59)
we talked about it earlier, but we talked about six degrees of connection. And so you really speak to the importance of relationships and a lot of people who presented or helped facilitate an opportunity, it's almost like you realize in hindsight with some of them or that there was even a connection.

It wasn't always, hey, I know this guy, let's call this friend. Sometimes you would realize in reverse that there was a connection point And so with almost everything, it's a relationship.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (15:23)
All right.

Yes.

Yes, and I would say with everything. It's not even almost. When I say it's very literal and I guess, you know, with some years, you know, some salt and pepper here, with some years you get to suss it out. And if it really is and if it's factual and it lands and if it works, in some years you'll know. You know, at first I didn't realize, I think that's where the hindsight kind of looking back comes into play. At first, you're not sure, but as you go along,

Angie Mizzell (15:34)
Mm-hmm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (15:57)
you can reflect and go, wait a minute, that guy, that random lady, that my granny who I speak about, who used to just, you know, encourage me because that's what grannies do, you're gonna be on Soul Train one day, baby. And I'm like, yeah. However, they're planting seeds. Some intentionally, some just moments that happen. Some kindness is somebody just smiling.

Everything is a connection.

and again, in the book, I like to pinpoint

the small moments that become, you know, the ripple effect that become the, that, that become the savior in a way. I mentioned a guy we met on the street, another turning point where we had, you know, up and down New York, think of it all, you know, get a record deal and 12 hours in, nothing, time to get back to the Greyhound station to make it home.

Angie Mizzell (16:50)
Mm-hmm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (16:51)
just before we were going back, you know, head low,

We was like, well, let's try one more. I mean, you know, it can't hurt. We're passing the Sony building, blah, blah, blah. This guy sees me and my brother. Me and my brother were dressed alike. That's what you did back there. You know, you look alike. And the guy literally just out of the blues says, hey, y'all a group?

Angie Mizzell (16:58)
Mm-hmm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (17:12)
And I'm like, yeah, yeah, we are. And at the time we weren't, but I was like, yeah. And he goes, well, yeah. And I start talking about it. I want to go up into Sony, but we don't know anyone. He goes, I got a meeting up there. Here, come walk up with me.

Angie Mizzell (17:14)
Yeah

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (17:25)
so the guy takes us in the building, which we wasn't going to be able to get into the first place. Security wasn't, didn't know us and does this thing and just encourages us to go ahead. I'm going to introduce you to this guy and you're going to have a meeting. What's interesting is nothing came from that meeting, but what did come from it.

was another victory. It's the mindset of victory. Like we made it in there.

Angie Mizzell (17:51)
you're starting to make it now, but you're broke. You don't have any money. And it took, you have to refresh my memory who it was, but it took someone pointing out to you, your dream's coming true. But you couldn't celebrate that moment because you were still living.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (17:57)
Woo, how about that?

Mmm.

Angie Mizzell (18:11)
paycheck to paycheck,

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (18:13)
Yes. Yeah.

Angie Mizzell (18:12)
Like your dream is coming true, but it didn't quite

feel like that because you were maybe still in the hustle and the struggle, but things were starting to happen.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (18:18)
Yeah, yes.

Angie Mizzell (18:21)
that shift anything? Yeah.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (18:21)
another keep going moment. It's

just a different

I was starting to make it. Things were happening, but I thought I was just going to get, you know, bags of money dropped on piles and piles and it was just going to be ecstasy and champagne wishes, cavier dreams, you know.

But that wasn't the case. So that right there, that's another reality check. ⁓ Yeah.

Angie Mizzell (18:45)
So you kept going, but

then you actually did get to that moment where you were like, wow, I can't believe this is my life. So tell me what was, was it a moment, was it a season where you were like, I've done it or I'm doing it, I'm here.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (18:51)
Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

So at first, some things were starting to happen and you know, but because maybe the bank account or maybe certain parts of my situation hadn't caught up or met up yet, you know, I was a little bit panic stricken, because I'm like, man, you know, all these things are happening, but I'm still deeply in the struggle. But then a moment occurred to where,

I received this unbelievable gift from this music entity and it was a gold record. It was my very first gold record, which by the way was something, it was the epitome. I used to tell myself, if I can, if I ever get that, that's it. I've done life and I can just mosey on

I received it in the middle of that particular struggle season, which I wasn't ready for. And shame-edly, I ignored it.

I didn't acknowledge it, not for what it was. It wasn't about the award, by the way, but for the, that I had pushed so hard and through everything that I.

I made myself go for and go through and other people and all the encouragement and all everyone fighting to believe in this mission. That was a celebratory thing that I didn't celebrate. So I got smacked back into reality and thankfully I had some help who was like, man, you, this is, did it. A hundred zillion people on this planet wish they could do that. And I was like, okay, that's it. Let me get my gratitude life, right.

So I got back and was thankful and I got my gratitude life back right. And then I got back to work. Fast forward a couple of years later, I started to receive some significant compensation

I was living that lifestyle to where I was being flown here, flown there and all these four star hotels, five star hotels, all around the globe, around the country, all these places. Like I was some big deal. And I did sit, I had many occasions to sit and pause and kind of be grateful and thankful that the dreams had not only come true, but way beyond anything that I ever imagined.

So, and I try to paint that in the book.

Angie Mizzell (21:16)
that came across,

definitely saw there was a spiritual component to it because music is who you are and music is your connection to everything. And I do think you painted that picture of that pull of the internal and the external because we live in a world where success is very external and

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (21:25)
Yeah. Yes.

Angie Mizzell (21:41)
But to have those moments where you're looking at a beautiful view outside on your hotel back balcony and you're like, you know, and now you're listening to worship music just so you can have a praiseworthy moment. You you really do tell this story with such humility and honesty

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (21:48)
Yes.

Angie Mizzell (22:01)
you seem to be grappling with the question of what is enough.

how high do I need to get? What do I actually need to achieve to feel like I've done what I came here to do?

I want to talk about like where you were touring with the Backstreet Boys, but you have your own business now, you're managing an artist, and you were really on the rise of all these things are coming together, and then things just stopped coming together, and it wasn't anything that you did or didn't do.

And you also say like, just as we're six degrees from connection, we're very close. We're as close to the breakthrough as we are to the fall at any given moment. And you don't know. So, Mookie what do you make of that? Because that's a lot,

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (22:44)
Yes.

Yes. Yeah. Yeah.

Angie Mizzell (22:50)
you know, but

It's a really important message for anyone who's ever looked at your life and thought, wow, he was living the dream. What happened?

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (22:58)
what seemed to be happening was a series of maybe stair-step full circle moments because in all of these things, as I'm seeming to rise and notch ahead, I'm taken back, or in my perception, I'm taken back because of circumstances.

Angie Mizzell (23:15)
Mm-hmm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (23:16)
which we don't control. And I'm learning that, I'm still learning that. We can control what we do, and that's it. Everything else is outside of us, so we don't need to be focused on it. in all of it, my North Star, again, like it is now and has been, was being a father, because that entered into my life as I was trying to make my...

stance to get into the music business. So that was my anchor. And in all of this, there were moments that were seemingly super highs, but I couldn't always receive it that way because there might be some physical separation from me and my son or later or towards towards the latter part, me and my son and my new daughter, Mercy at the time. And and I was a single father. So

Thankfully I had my parents, they stepped in the breach and would help take care of him when things started to happen. And it was wonderful family unity in that way. But I started to realize that,

What is, when you, to the question about what is enough, I'd reflect in these high moments and I wouldn't always find myself as happy as I should be according to my calculations when I make these gold records or whatever. Because I was missing the most important component, which is being there.

Angie Mizzell (24:27)
Mm-hmm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (24:38)
with my son, being there with my children, like I wanted to be.

so fast forwarding towards the end of my career there, I started just deciding, I started doing things that might not necessarily have been, you know,

good projections for my career, but it would mean that I had more connection with my kids. And that's when I realized in terms of happy, was like, what's really important? What's really enough? Now I didn't say I wanted to, you know, completely be booted out the business and then back to square one and start gigging again, which is what happened, frankly. But I had remembered when I was maybe at the, my,

Angie Mizzell (25:00)
Yep.

That's right.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (25:21)
brokest state, not just financially, but just in terms of hope and where I could be in life. And my son at the time, my first born was not two years old and we were struggling and we could barely eat. I was on food stamps, all the things, living in Boston, was a depression, all these things were happening. And then looking at his face,

and looking back at each other, I remember it as if it's yesterday. The smile, his smile, his face could light up the globe. He was removed. Nothing that I thought was so traumatic. It wasn't. It was almost like he was giving me the, the go ahead, keep going. It's like his smile was like, go ahead. It isn't as bad as you think, dad. And I get emotional thinking about it, but that

Angie Mizzell (26:02)
Hmm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (26:13)
was one of the happiest, most precious times of my life that spawned all of this, all of that. So it came to a point where, wait a minute, I can't, none of this can be removed from that. If it is, then I'm not necessarily where I need to be. And when my mind, I believe when your mind starts going that direction, your mind and heart, the circumstance will meet you.

Angie Mizzell (26:41)
Yeah.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (26:41)
I didn't

want to fall and fail because I started to towards the end of my life and know things, circumstances happened and you know out of my control. But I think my energy, my mind was battling and circumstances came and said, well you can't figure it out here we're going to help you.

Angie Mizzell (26:58)
you had already proven from your past that when things you're on the rise and it started circumstances started to make it feel like it was going on the down, you had enough history to know you could have kept going and just made it through that setback. But you were being torn and it's really obvious that you can't ever

You couldn't have had that life without sacrificing the other. Everybody's got to sacrifice something and you just have to figure out what am I sacrificing? And I think it was more of that internal thing that was like, need, that was bringing you home. And you did find what was important to you. And yet the music is still there. In many ways you talk about, you your life has come.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (27:32)
Yes.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Angie Mizzell (27:49)
full circle, but it's very beautiful in that full circle, like almost like just right back down to your roots. And there's other ways you're making an impact. So we can talk about that in a minute. let's talk about the title, the Happy Has Been. And some people thought it was like the Happy Has Been. And it's almost like the different way you say it. But you're like, no, Happy Has Been.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (27:55)
Yeah.

Yes. Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Angie Mizzell (28:15)
what does it mean now for you to be a has-been and for all of us to embrace what we have been. And I really do think you make that point well in your story and it's where you found your peace in this stage of life. tell us more your thoughts about that.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (28:24)
Yes.

Yes, so absolutely.

Like when you hear the word has been, you know, a dark cloud covers you.

through all of this, my entire experience, love came to my rescue,

The love I have for my kids, the way we interact, the way I just enjoy the connection and engagement of people. It's literally, it makes me, it brings joy to my life. And I feel like I'm getting this joy. I want to return it.

Angie Mizzell (29:01)
Mm-hmm.

you

Mm-hmm.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (29:08)
But

the happy has been, I wanted to take that term and make people understand that if you are going for your life and you're keeping on going, you're not giving up. When you get to a point and you can reflect, think of all that you have been. That's what I say, all that you have done, everything that you have attempted.

That is you. That is you have encouraged lives you don't even understand or you don't even know. So that should give you a smile and give you pride. So it's basically me saying I'm proud to have been and have done these things and have been blessed to have been able to do that. There's nothing to be ashamed of. And I get to live now and return into the roots playing music.

And raising my kids, I got one little guy left, most of them they're going on college, doing what they're doing as you know. But the point is, the happiness isn't in the actual achievement itself. Yes, don't disregard it, but the happiness is having been able to be a part of something like this, something like what you're doing, something like what.

anyone who has an endeavor, a goal that they're involved in, there is something special about it as you continue. So that's it. I don't want anyone to think negatively about anyone who has been or done anything. There's a joy there.

Angie Mizzell (30:33)
It's a conclusion I came to looking back on my television news career. There was a period of time that it was good and I was happy and I still look back and like I wouldn't have traded that. It was a special time in my life, but I don't want to go back to that. don't, in this season of life, it is not what I wanted any longer, but it's still a part of who I am and part of my story.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (30:46)
Yes.

Right.

Right.

Angie Mizzell (31:02)
that I share in my memoir is about leaving the spotlight. And yet here I am in the spotlight, you know, hosting a podcast. I'm an author and yeah, but it's different because the motivation is different. It is less about, it's not filling a void inside of me, meaning I'm not pursuing the spotlight.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (31:04)
Yes, that's right. It's beautiful.

See how that works? Isn't that weird? Yeah.

Angie Mizzell (31:25)
anymore to feel like my life is meaningful. The spotlight is a vehicle, it's a tool, it's a way to do what I love to do, which is tell stories and communicate and make connection. And I know you feel that same way about music. it's less about fame.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (31:25)
Exactly.

Yes. Yes.

Angie Mizzell (31:42)
But when someone calls you a has-been, it almost speaks to like the negative voices we have in our own head. And I do think it speaks to, the way society at large looks at success as some sort of savior. once you've achieved success, you've got to stay there or you're nothing.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (31:54)
Yeah, yes.

Angie Mizzell (32:00)
And it's like the more we can do to redefine what happiness is, what success is, what joy really is, the happier we'll be, the happy we will find.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (32:00)
Right, right.

Yes,

because it's not See, here's the thing. We're going to life is going to make sure we understand that all those things, you know, the success factor that's so fleeting life will make sure they teach you that. So I'm not busy trying to teach people that part of it.

Angie Mizzell (32:28)
⁓

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (32:30)
What I'm trying to share with people is two things. The love

The love in your heart, when you go outward with it, stop worrying about yourself so much, by the way, but that all of that can turn around so that you don't rely, your reliance on a particular metric isn't your everything. Yes, goals, let things motivate you, but don't rely on that as the substance. The substance is that love that is the act.

of being and doing. That's where the happiness comes. That's why I can't stop smiling. I'm the happy, I am the happy has been

look, I got stories all day. I've done all these things that make people go, wow, ride around drinking champagne with Mariah Carey and limos in New York City.

I remember, but some funnier moments is having, after a night full of Heineken's,

Me and a couple of guys from the Backsheet Boys and some friends, close friends, going out in a parking lot at one of their places and wrestling till four in the morning, waking up the next day, like, broken, know, all messed up. And then the record company getting mad at me because I had these guys out here in the streets. But that's happiness. Those are moments in time. You have those. Those are yours. You are good. You got those. So embrace that.

Angie Mizzell (33:32)
Hahaha.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (33:48)
and then you get to live and have a life now. You get all of that and you get what you got now. And who knows what's next? As long as you remember, if you are here, you can keep going, period.

Angie Mizzell (34:00)
That's a word. So we're going to talk about the happiness that you're continuing to spread and share. Tell everybody about the projects you've been working on since The Happy Has Been came out.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (34:01)
That's a word.

Okay, I'm gonna try and be brief, one of them's pretty emotional. So after that, I wrote another

It's called Letters to My Son, Roman, Love on the Spectrum. I have a young son who's seven and a half, and he is autistic, non-verbal, and he's the love of my life. He's reinvented my fatherhood. He's given me new experiences, new ways to connect.

non-verbally. So that's a whole new love language which we're going to talk about, by the way. I'll get there. And then I put together a children's book series based on Roman, I call it Roman's World, the adventures of Roman's World where it isn't just about autism, it's about anti-bullying, inclusion, and just making sure that kids see love in every

every iteration, the spectrum on every form. And I did that with that little baby boy who inspired me 30 something years ago. He's the illustrator and I'm the writer. we did that. And so we're working on more of those. And currently,

both of our friend Chef Brett McGee is doing his memoir and I'm co-writing it with him. I'm co-authoring the book with him and let me tell you.

Everyone's gonna want to get this book. If anyone knows or doesn't know Chef Brett, he is a larger than life, big teddy bear of a dude, but boy, he's lived quite a story.

I basically just took the author mantle seriously. Like I'm really loving writing and it's a passion of mine.

there's another project I'm working on.

both of our dear friend, Nina Sossaman, she has been one of my mentors and guides throughout

She wants to get me speaking with some people. And so she's helping me with a keynote. And so in my research and in my heart and working on this, a book is coming out of it.

And it's something beautiful and it is about love. And some of it is using parts of my story in terms of as a father and in engaging in the world in general. Yes, music is part of it, but it's more of some of the keys and lessons that I've learned that I want to share that are love-based. it's good for your family. It's definitely needed in the...

Angie Mizzell (36:20)
Yeah.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (36:26)
corporate space, I can promise you that, and my little bit of, you know, and my entry into it, it's about empathy and it's about the powerful tool that love is. it's the thing that sparks movement.

Angie Mizzell (36:29)
Mm-hmm.

Hi

I would definitely love to see your message in the form of a keynote I look forward to seeing what's next from you and how can people find you?

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (36:50)
I mean, I'm all over social media, Jonathan Mookie Morant, Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, TikTok. Thank you. My daughters, they're like, dad, you gotta get your TikTok right. And I have an email. I love communicating and engaging with people. So my direct email is themagnumdrummer at gmail.com. Maybe we can leave the link for them or whatever.

And I have a website, thehappyhasbeen.com. And that's where I introduced my book, but also now future books and whatever I'm working on.

Angie Mizzell (37:25)
So if people wanted

to get your other books, they could go to that website also.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (37:28)
Absolutely,

yes. I'm gonna make sure the links are there, of course, all over social media. me and a dear friend of mine, Laura Patrick, And also with the help of Chef Brett, I started a foundation it's called Roman's World Foundation, where we aim to help the autism community,

raising money for awareness and for programs and also for direct aid for families because it is needed. And so all that information is on the website as well.

Angie Mizzell (37:55)
Well, Mookie, I am glad that our six degrees of connection brought us together at the perfect time. It's so wonderful to know you as a friend and also hear more about your story and help share your message, in all the ways because you're doing good work. So thank you for being here today.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (38:14)
Thank you Angie.

You're amazing and your book is amazing. I can't wait for your next one. Hint, hint. Maybe we'll have to team up. I wanna do some fiction. I wanna do something. Let's craft a story. I think we can do this. I think we can add all our life stories together and come up with something crazy, fun.

Angie Mizzell (38:22)
Yo, yeah. wow.

Mmm.

Angie and Mookie

go to New York. Adventures of Angie and Mookie.

Jonathan "Mookie" Morant (38:33)
Let's go. Oh, that's it. Oh, that's even a children's book. I could

see the children's book already. Let's do it. Let's do it. Yeah.

Angie Mizzell (38:41)
my goodness, thank you  much for being here.

Angie Mizzell (38:45)
So here's what I loved about my conversation with Mookie. His story isn't just about how success can come and go. It's about the deeper lesson to lead with love and that a meaningful life is built through connection. If that message resonates, I think you'll like Hello Friday. It's my weekly note where I share personal reflections and stories just like this one. You can subscribe at angiemizzell.com

or through the link in my show notes. Thank you for listening to More Like You. I'll see you back here next week.